Sarah and Jeff, a friend and another friend/subordinate’s wife, are the two who responded to my reaching out for help, when I was trying to understand the truth, but as the author of From Charm to Harm advises ” dealing with a Narcissist in the ‘here and now’ is that there is NO possible way that you can make them understand or accept responsibility concerning their dehumanization of people – especially when it concerns you – it will only enrage them more and they will lash out at you more – it is a NO WIN SITUATION with a Narcissist! The Narcissist will distort everything using familiarity (from knowing our innermost secrets) with vicious lies about you to protect themselves from exposure and instill fear into us…They will stop at nothing to prove that you are the source of the collapse of this relationship, a liar, loser, abusive, the person having affairs, etc., and basically the person who deserves all the blame. Along the same lines trying to explain your side of the story to people will make you seem crazy because our stories are incredulous! You will only feel invalidated and frustrated trying to tell the truth over and over again and hearing those dismissing comments to just move on because time heals all!” This exchange also shows the writer to be right in that in trying to defend myself, I came out looking like the crazy one. It’s frightening how they can steal your identity you don’t even know what’s happening.
Keep in mind I had just been assaulted. I had a concussion, and was in shock and barely functioning. What’s surprising or should I say this demonstrates how how good he is when it comes to fooling people, Sarah is a speech therapist who helps people like me gain back their cognitive abilities after trauma yet her response was her standing over me and pouring salt over an open would when she blamed me for provoking him.
Her email is yet another characteristic of a narcissist who goes on a smear campaign. Beside the few days we spent in Vegas at a conference I barely knew her. That said, I liked her and we had good conversations. She was open, but I felt I needed to keep it professional because despite Vince and her husband being friends he’s his boss and I didn’t think it was appropriate to talk a lot about personal business . Facts are that Vince never had my back, he talked behind my back and said horrible things, none which were true. For example, as if you needed another one, telling Jeff he was trying to break up with me And at the same tim telling me he wants to hold me and be with me. It’s overwhelming to think about.
I met Jeff twice but had reached out to him a couple of times when I was frustrated with Vince. The emotions he was referring to was my crying to him a day or two after I was assaulted, and the angry emails I sent were, again, because I had been attacked and wanted to talk to someone who knew him. I was emotional but I HAD JUST BEEN ATTACKED! To have been abused so severely and then judged and persecuted for how “emotional” I was is maddening.
On Mon, Jan 16, 2017 at 11:12 AM, Jeff G <email@example.com> wrote:
I wanted to wait a few days before I responded,and to be honest – I’m not sure I wanted to. First off, I’m sorry and disappointed you chose to read a private chat between me and Vince. Despite what you think, Vince really does care about you, and I don’t believe he’s intentionally tried to, for a lack of a better work, gas-light you. Did Vince lie to you? I’m sure he did. Vince is a master-avoider. He’ll say and do things to get out of the situation – probably even lie and manipulate because he’s a smart guy. But the reason he does this is not to try to make you crazy, but to selfishly escape his immediate problems and push them down the road. The problem with this strategy is that he can’t keep pushing his problems down the road and they will eventually catch up with him, which they have.From my conversation with Vince and confirmed in your email messages, I can tell that you have a temper Vesta and are prone to extreme emotional responses. I’m not saying it’s right, but people with those traits are often lied to or given half-truth’s because so often the messenger is shot, and if that messenger is someone like Vince who tries to avoid conflict at all cost, then it really paints a clear picture for me. You two were not able to honestly and effectively communicate on anything of emotional substance in your relationship, nor will you two EVER be able to.That’s why my advice to Vince was, even though you still have these feelings for her, you need to let Vesta go. If you care about her, let her go. You (Vince) are not good for her. It’s a hard message to hear for him because despite all the chaos and embarrassment you’ve caused him, he probably.I have the same message for you Vesta, but I could tell it was also a message you didn’t want to hear. From my perspective, you were an incredibly chaotic and destructive force in Vince’s life. You both were to each other.Vesta, all guys are mainly idiots when it comes to women. We mostly think with our dicks. We all say stupid shit, especially when we’re scared and feel cornered. Sounds like Vince majored in that lately, but he did not want any of this to happen. He’s letting you go because it’s better for you.I know you’ve implied that there’s something more insidious and conspiratorial going on with Vince and his family. I just don’t see any evidence of that, and please don’t send me any more emails on that subject. The more you allow yourself to believe this line of thought, the more you are going to make yourself crazy. If I am wrong, and there is probably some very very small chance that I am, the best revenge is to lead a good life. What you have been doing with online shaming and embarrassment is a shallow pursuit and only validates a narrative where you are a crazy woman spurned.So lastly, a harsh message to both of you: Grow the fuck up and do what’s right for your kids. Whatever that may be, but I can guarantee it’s NOT staying together in any way. Be nice to each other and go on and lead a good life.
Jeff Gooder, CTO
On Jan 15, 2017, at 6:29 AM, sarah sh <firstname.lastname@example.org> wrote:
Vesta,I have not responded to your line of inquiry and questioning as it doesn’t dignify a response. I have blocked you from my FB account and do not want any future communication with you. You do not get to accuse me of not being a feminist and/or making assumptions about what I am or am not thinking.I am going to give you a little insight into my thoughts before I cease communication with you. I think both domestic abuse and mental health are extremely important issues. It has been clear for a long time to many people in Vince’s life that your mental health issues are significant and pose a serious road block to your ability to function in daily life and the ability for you to participate in a healthy, functional relationship. Not only with Vince, but with your family and friends. But Vince stayed with you, and brought his own unique set of issues to your relationship. You are not the victim here, you have victimized each other and have fostered a disfunctional relationship that is coming to an extremely ugly demise, as most disfunctional and toxic relationships do.It is absolutely inappropriate and unexceptable that Vince laid his hands on you. I think if you feel that the situation that occurred on the night in question was clearly assault, then you should absolutely pursue your charges. However, this manic and vengeful smear campaign of Vince is equally as reprehensible and criminal in my opinion. I hope that Vince will get his day in court as well to charge you with libel and slander. I know you wrote that ‘it’s not libel if it’s true’. You may be able to share that Vince assaulted you, but making the case that Vince is a monster who has been emotionally abusing you for years is not true.You’re right, I do know a bit about psychology. I know that Vince is not ‘gaslighting’ you. The two examples you keep harping on (Christmas, pictures) are ridiculous!!! This is not gaslighting, this is Vince clearly avoiding conflict and confrontation from you, because as you mentioned, you have ‘yelled and thrown things’. (I hope nothing has hit Vince, giving him cause to charge you with assault.) The fact that you admit to going through Vince’s emails like it’s no big deal continues to support how totally dysfunctional your relationship was. I have never gone through Tim’s email. You are committing libel by writing that Vince is a narcissist and emotionally abusive, Vince can not be a narcissist AND be conflict-avoidant, both of which you claim him to be. You have zero case for accusing him of committing abuse, when your relationship was clearly one that was mutually perpetuated and toxic. Your behavior, many instances noted, was not that of someone who was abused. It is clear that Vince was not ‘controlling’ you as you appeared to say and do whatever you wanted.For your information I have not talked to Vince, and from the conversations Tim has had, Vince has not tried to justify his behavior or make excuses like you say. Vince has not called you names, which I would have, or made any negative comments toward you at all. Vince told Tim, ‘I think it’s really over this time.’ Which leads me to believe that he clearly cared for you, however dysfunctional your relationship was. Which means that Vince is also a victim here.You are extremely quick to shout from the rooftops what a terrible person Vince is, yet you have not given any indication of the situation surrounding your assault, which leads me to believe that there may have been mutual involvement. I am a feminist, but I also believe that women should not play the ‘victim’ when they also are instigators. I hope for the sake of every woman who has faced unprovoked violence in her relationships and home that you are clear in your story and the details of your assault, because as a feminist I hold myself and other women to a high standard of behavior. One you are not meeting with your childish emails, posts and accusations. Fortunately, the court system is very good at weeding through these situations. I hope you have a good lawyer, but I suspect not, as every time you send an email or write a post you make your case weaker.You claim that you’re taking back your dignity with all your emails and posts, but there is absolutely nothing dignified about the way you are handling this situation.You want to talk ‘woman to woman’, here is my advice:
Show a gleam of maturity and put the four children you have drug into this situation first. Drop the charges, step away from the computer, focus on yourself and your relationship with your children.
I truly wish the best for you and your children Vesta. And hope you can work towards cultivating peace and contentment in your life.Sarah
On Saturday, January 14, 2017, Vesta wrote:Y.“This is not gaslighting, this is Vince clearly avoiding conflict and confrontation from you, because as you mentioned, you have ‘yelled and thrown things’. (I hope nothing has hit Vince, giving him cause to charge you with assault.) “Little Ms. Know it all,How do you know anything about my relationship with my friends or family. Beside what Vince has told you what do you really know about me. Of course you have to stick up for Vince. He’s your paycheck’s boss and as you said in Vegas does a lot for Tim. Remember how upset you were at Tim choosing to go get drunk with Jeff and not show up at the IBM event he was suppose to. Vince certainly covered his ass, didn’t he, by not reprimanding him so I suggest you keep your opinions to yourself given you are factually wrong on everythings including knowing the law.You weren’t in the relationship and have no idea whether Vince was a monster or not so given what he put me through and unlike you who assumed the two examples were it, you have no business telling me what I lived through and what I did not, and what I experience was emotional abuse or not. And, to clarify, I ripped our pictures up. I ripped our photo albums up and because what we had was not real. So, no I never threw anything at him. Unlike him I don’t lose control to the point where I physically hurt people. He on the other hand…well the bruises speak for themselves and if you think any woman deserves what he did than you are a horrible mother to be teaching your daughter to behave or otherwise the man in her life gets to beat her up. You start out by saying I should press charges if I feel I was assaulted and then you tell me to drop it and think of the four kids when the four kids are not involved. Why would you assume I would bring kids into this? Would you bring kids into this? Reality is, you don’t really know me and you have to protect your income so I get it. &&&&&**())_____TRR^%%$##@@ Anything is possible given he’s as pathological as he is…Anyway, If you want me to drop the charges bullying me or trying to scare me didn’t. Vince already tried that and failed.